Comment · Tue, January 7, 2020
D + K + Magnesium Stack Capsule
Original post in this thread
ShouldReallyGetWorkn · 4 points
I have a pretty oversized pill case for all the daily supplements I take. It's tedious to portion out my vitamin D, Magnesium, and vitamin K every few weeks into each pill box compartment.
I consider those 3 and fish oil as my baseline supplements so it would be nice if I could get those all in the same capsules instead of having to juggle through all my pill bottles.
I realize that might make for very large capsules, but I wouldn't mind taking multiple if it still saves me that effort in dealing with different bottles and restocking each.
Any chance something like that might be in the future?
What they were answering
juantoconero · 1 points
Most (if not all) of the Japanese clinical studies on K2 are using MK-4. Searching "Menatetrenone " in Pubmed and filtering for only human studies returns 178 results. 112 human based studies come back when searching "MK-4" and 231 human based studies for " Menaquinone-4 ".
u/MisterYouAreSoDumb
Have you read those studies and looked how much they were using? The doses they are using are insane! 45mg of MQ-4 for a bone fracture and Osteoporosis study... That's MASSIVE. Sure, you can account for low bioavailability by jacking the dose up by hundreds of times. That doesn't mean it has any relevance to supplemental doses, though. I see many supplement products with 50-100mcg MQ-4. That's 450 times LOWER than that Japanese Menatetrenone study on Osteoporosis. Might as well just take placebo at that point. I'm looking through a bunch of those studies now, and they are using 15-135mg in all of them. That's 15,000-135,000mcg if you want to put them in the same units as used in most supplements. The study I linked above compared 420mcg of both MQ-4 and MQ-7. Supplemental doses of MQ-7 are 100-200mcg, usually. So those Menatetrenone studies are proving my point. MQ-4 is extremely low in bioavailability.
This is what I mean by the fact that I don't want to just put things in our products to have them on our label. That's called "label dressing" and is used by many companies out there to make it look like their products are better than they are. Using 100-200mcg of MQ-4 is not going to have any relevance to those clinical studies you are talking about, just like taking 2mg of curcumin isn't going to be relevant to those studies, either. All evidence I can see is that MQ-4 is worthless from a supplement point of view, unless you jack the doses up by hundreds of times. At that point, why not just take a higher dose of MQ-7? It converts to MQ-4 in the body anyway. This is why I am not settled on a formulation yet. If we just copied what everyone else is doing, what's the point? We do the research and bring things out that make sense. Does adding 15-45mg of MQ-4 to a supplement with MQ-7 make sense? Again, I am still researching and deciding myself. One thing is for certain: adding 50-100mcg of MQ-4 makes ZERO sense! That's just companies putting shit in there to confuse people and make it seem like their product is better. Things have to make sense for me before I pull the trigger, and I am just not settled on whether or not we should be using 25,000% of your RDA to reach clinical significance.