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Comment · Sat, May 7, 2016 · Ceretropic & Nootropics Depot

Probiotics and fermented foods

Original post in this thread

vapenationvn · 21 points

I read a lot about articles on probiotics and fermented foods (kefir, sauerkraut, kimchi, etc.) and wanted to try it for mood and cognition.

I would like to know if any of you tried probiotics or fermented foods and what were the effects?

What they were answering

sleepycorn · 3 points

So Epicor boosts the immune system. Do we have any reason to believe this is a good thing (in a person that does not get sick all the time)?

Because allergies, inflammation, and even multiple sclerosis seem to be caused by the immune system. My impression is that Epicor measured improvements in immune markers but did not measure immune outcomes.

Published studies show EpiCor helps people live more healthy days by: Supporting year-round respiratory and sinus health -source

"Supporting" is a verb companies typically use when they can't actually say it caused improvement, though I don't know what it means in this case. I would love to have improved sinus health, but I can't be sure my immune system isn't causing sinus problems.

Though it helped you a ton, is there any reason to think it'll be a net positive for someone who doesn't have a weakened immune system?

u/MisterYouAreSoDumb · Ceretropic & Nootropics Depot

You have to use that type of wording with supplements in all cases, or the FDA can claim you are attempting to treat a disease. They have to say "supports" or "promotes." Those are the rules for dietary supplements, as the FDA considers them foods, not drugs. It has no bearing on the actual efficacy of a supplement. Supplements support your diet. Drugs treat diseases. That is the FDA rule. The wording companies use is all about legalities, not the actual efficacy of the product. They could be linked in some cases. However, you could have a supplement that cured cancer 100% of the time, with thousands of peer-reviewed studies proving it, and that would still say "supports recovery from cancer" or something similar. If you make claims of treating a disease, you need to put it through FDA drug trials; which by the way are now up to an average of $2.6 Billion to get to market for the total development.

A Tough Road: Cost To Develop One New Drug Is $2.6 Billion; Approval Rate for Drugs Entering Clinical Development is Less Than 12%

Does it really cost $2.6 billion to develop a new drug?

Now to your actual question. Epicor modulates the immune system, regulating it. It increases interleuken-10 levels, and improves the function of natural killer T cells. It does this by lowering CD8 suppressor cells, that deactivate T cells, and improves the ratio of CD8 to CD4 helper cells. It actually improves natural killer cell function, while lowering the total NK cell count. The measured improvement in NK cell function was 2-3x. It also increases immunoglobulin A in the various mucosal surfaces around the body, along with increasing the body's antioxidant systems.

So think of it like a prebiotic that improves your immune function at your mucous membranes. This actually lowers natural killer cell count, but makes them more efficient. So it not only improves immune function from a fighting off pathogens standpoint, but it also LOWERS seasonal allergies and other overactive immune responses.

A Double-Blind Placebo-Controlled, Randomized Pilot Study: Consumption of a High-Metabolite Immunogen from Yeast Culture has Beneficial Effects on Erythrocyte Health and Mucosal Immune Protection in Healthy Subjects

A Dried Yeast Fermentate Selectively Modulates both the Luminal and Mucosal Gut Microbiota and Protects against Inflammation, As Studied in an Integrated in Vitro Approach

Antioxidant Bioavailability and Rapid Immune-Modulating Effects After Consumption of a Single Acute Dose of a High-Metabolite Yeast Immunogen: Results of a Placebo-Controlled Double-Blinded Crossover Pilot Study

The HMI™ module: a new tool to study the Host-Microbiota Interaction in the human gastrointestinal tract in vitro

Novel Immune System Enhancer Strengthens Microbial and Mutagenic Defense

A Dried Yeast Fermentate Prevents and Reduces Inflammation in Two Separate Experimental Immune Models

Effects of a Modified Yeast Supplement on Cold/Flu Symptoms

So you can see that there is good scientific evidence for Epicor's efficacy, not only in preventing the cold and flu, but also allergies and other inflammatory issues.

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