Comment · Thu, December 6, 2012 · Ceretropic
Why not meditate?
Original post in this thread
GuysRelax · 34 points
After reading through links and comments I find many people are concerned about safety. There doesn't seem to be a single substance that works on everyone so people are trying mixes. Some people are taking pictures posting to make sure their "substance" is legit. Apparently effects are subtle anyway. Some of the substances sold on amazon have either extremely positive reviews or extremely negative.
So after checking out the top posts, it seems about 10 months ago someone posted a study on meditation. Its the 9th top link of the year on this subreddit.
Of course I am speaking from an ignorant position having not tried nootropics but I would still like to reopen this comparison and ask if our goal is to enhance cognition and we have studies that show meditation does just this, why are we seeking substances?
Should I combine practices? Should we all?
What they were answering
octousan · 5 points
I wonder if you're making an unnecessary distinction here between psychological control and mechanisms. Meditation makes very real alterations to the mind such as long term structural, neuroprotective, persistent brainwave synchrony, and neurochemical changes. The subjective arises from the physical, yes? It's as well to meditate with expectations based on what you know about neuroanatomy as it is to take a substance, imho. There may be more studies on nootropics, but meditation is definitely getting there. Personally, I feel that meditation is a stronger enhancer (and I take a LOT of nootropics).
The other thing, looking for effects as acute as those offered by most nootropics, enhancing the subjective sensitivity to their effects is a third of your quest. The others of course being to study mechanisms and eat drugs.
I understand what you're saying though and share the opinion that studying mechanisms is foremost. OP's just got me proselytizing for my favorite endogenous 'nootropic'.
u/MisterYouAreSoDumb · Ceretropic
It's necessary. What regions of your brain are activated during meditation? What catecholamines are release at the various stages of your session? What receptor sub-types are responsible for the increased cognition and memory recall? Quantitatively, what has been enhanced at the cellular level during the meditation session? There is no way to answer all of these questions given our current abilities. That is, unless someone wants to meditate and have brain samples taken for testing.
How can we advance the scientific understanding of our brain, if we limit ourselves to the subjective perceptions of the changes that occur during meditation? Sure we can observe reactions, and do cognitive tests to see if certain things have been improved or not. However, why were they improved? Did the meditation session increase excitability at your ion channels? If so, what neurotransmitter was released to accomplish it, and from where? Did the session stimulate a release of BDNF, and if so, what caused it?
I am not discounting meditation. I am merely making the case for nootropics. The more we can quantitatively assess at a cellular level, what is happening when cognition is enhanced, and memories are formed, the closer we come to fully understanding the mechanisms behind our subjective reality.