Comment · Thu, January 14, 2016 · Ceretropic & Nootropics Depot
Let's talk about eating/drinking to protect the liver when using nootropics / hepatoxicity
Original post in this thread
southernhell · 21 points
Hello, all!
I'm relatively new to the world of nootropics-my current stack includes piracetam, gingko biloba, bacopa, fish oil, rhodiola rosea and choline bitartrate. I also am on an SNRI and a low dose of a benzodiazepine. Today is my first day of adding adrafinil to this stack-however, I am hearing that it is bad for the liver (luckily i very rarely drink alcohol, and even moreso more than 1-2 drinks), which concerns me. I'm considering not using it in my "everyday for extended periods of time" stack due to this reason.
I've seen milk thistle extolled for it's liver cleansing properties (I suspect I do not have the chem/bio background of many here, I am a lowely lib arts girl, so excuse the lack of terminology), but I was wondering if there are any other ways others using nootropics avoid taxing their liver.
I've recently discovered that I actually enjoy drinking water with lemon/grapefruit/citrus/cucumbers and crushed garlic/ginger, as well as other herbs (I also drink far more water this way). From what I've heard (albeit from holistic communities, hence skepticisim), lemon and garlic are great "tonics" for the liver.
How do y'all give your liver some lovin'?
What they were answering
IsNotANovelty · 2 points
Where is the "adrafinil is bad for the liver" common wisdom coming from? Yes, adrafinil is metabolized into modafinil by the liver. Tons of drugs are metabolized by the liver, yet aren't demonized like adrafinil. You could take a single recommended dose (325mg) of acetaminophen every day for the rest of your life without adverse effect on your liver (studies have shown long-term doses of up to 4,000mg be safe). So why are we so sure that using adrafinil at recommended dosages is more dangerous? I've not seen any studies that show this. It's more of "we don't know whether long-term use is safe," than "it's definitely bad." Which applies to many nootropics.
Calling /u/MisterYouAreSoDumb if he has any more information regarding adrafinil's safety profile.
u/MisterYouAreSoDumb · Ceretropic & Nootropics Depot
There is zero evidence that Adrafinil damages the liver. It has been shown to raise certain liver enzymes, as does Modafinil. The issue is that raised liver enzymes just means the liver is working harder, not that it is being damaged. As you said, Acetaminophen raises liver enzymes, and can be taken safely at certain dosages. Damage happens once you go over a certain dosage, and in some at-risk people. Doctors were advised to watch people's liver function on Adrafinil, which some people took to mean that Adrafinil was for sure damaging the liver. What it really meant was that it was metabolized in the liver, and some elderly or at-risk people could be affected by that. The liver tests were a precautionary measure, like they often are in all prodrug use. I also think that Cephalon played into the fears a lot, once they had the patent to Modafinil. Getting people scared of Adrafinil, so they move to Modafinil, is an easy way to increase profits for your patented drug. Remember, Adrafinil was discovered first, which is what led to discovering Modafinil.