Comment · Thu, February 22, 2024 · ND Owner
Does Infini-B have too much Niacin? Concerns.
Original post in this thread
jimmythegreek1 · 16 points
I'll first post the links to an explanation to the study and the study itself. It seems to be a landmark study on niacin.
"Excess Niacin Fuels Inflammation, Cardiovascular Disease through Newly Discovered Pathway"
Note: I have only read the above article/abstract. I am still trying to find the actual full study to read through it. I am just a layman on this subject.
Essentially, excess niacin can promote inflammation and cardiovascular risk. There have always been questions on niacin - it can notably reduce LDL, increase HDL, even decrease triglycerides. But even with all that, it has never been linked to lower rates of death, heart attack or stroke, so scientists presumed there could be an unknown mechanism at play. There have even been studies suggesting that niacin could increase all-cause mortality. There are also multiple studies showing that niacin can increase the risk of developing diabetes.
The study seems to have e…
What they were answering
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u/MisterYouAreSoDumb · ND Owner
Well well well... Ol Stanley Hazen is back with another hit piece study!
Once is a coincidence. Twice is a pattern.
1) They analyzed bloodwork for cardiac patients, but not for healthy people without cardiac issues.
Yep, it is a classic case of when you are a hammer, everything is a nail. You can't just study a sample size of a diseased state without having a healthy group in there.
What is considered excess niacin? They mentioned fortification of niacin in flour/cereal - what about people not consuming these crap foods who are overall more healthy than the general pop, and getting their niacin from a B vitamin supplement or meat?
Exactly. You can't come out with a paper like this with so few details on forms and doses...
Did they actually measure niacin intake from supplements or from food? Maybe these problematic niacin metabolites are from being in a generally diseased state as opposed to niacin intake.
It doesn't look like they did.
4) There was a clear association with the gene rs10496731. What about those who don't have this variant? How wide spread is this variant in the general population?
That's going to require more studies. No doubt Ol Stanley will do it, and charge you to read it.
5) Was this study sponsored by pharma companies? Judging from the abstract it appears not, but I cannot say for sure. EDIT: The "Ethics" portion at the bottom seems worrisome.
I think we all know the answer to this one! They are getting sneaking with how they sponsor them.
S.L.H. and Z.W. report being named as co-inventors on pending and issued patents held by the Cleveland Clinic relating to cardiovascular diagnostics and therapeutics. S.L.H. and Z.W. also report having received royalty payments for inventions or discoveries related to cardiovascular diagnostics or therapeutics from Cleveland Heart Lab, a fully owned subsidiary of Quest Diagnostics, and Procter & Gamble. S.L.H. is a paid consultant for Zehna Therapeutics and Proctor & Gamble and has received research funds from Zehna Therapeutics, Proctor & Gamble, Pfizer and Roche Diagnostics. W.H.W.T. is a consultant for Sequana Medical A.V., Cardiol Therapeutics, Genomics plc, Zehna Therapeutics and Renovacor and has received honoraria from Springer Nature for authorship/editorship and from the American Board of Internal Medicine for exam writing committee service.
Paired with Stanley Hazen's other papers, I am convinced this is a new strategy for pharma companies to poison the well on certain supplements in advance of a new drug or treatment they are working on. That doesn't mean the findings are all wrong. It doesn't mean we can't learn things from the papers. It just means we need to put them in the proper context. Study design can be altered to show what the researchers want to show.
6) Does the form of niacin matter, i.e. nicotinic acid vs niacinamide?
That's the million dollar question. We didn't use niacin for a reason. We used niacinamide and inositol hexanicotinate. We did a ton of research, and went back and forth many times, deciding on the final doses of everything. This paper was not out then, so I don't think these metabolites came up, though. We'll have to research a bit more.